Curse

Shanaeri Rynale · Dec 30, 2006, 02:18 PM // 14:18

Quote:

Most people cant casually save up 8k for an ecto, because they need the gold for other more important things.

Thats why Im not counting ecto into my debate. Its not a form of wealth which everyone possesses.

Neither are gold, diamonds,houses, $$ stock options or owning companies and yet they are all counted as wealth. In game people's worth is also counted as the amount of ecto,black dye, weapons etc etc they have so just because x% of players don't have them does not mean they should be discounted.

We're not talking about lower end trades below the limit, but the hassle of over 100K ones. If you're not ever going to trade or have these amounts then the limit has no effect on you.

However when you have that lucky drop and want to sell that perfect uber item it sure will as you will want the cold hard cash rather than having to mess about with material values.

Point I'm making is
Having to use another material to supplement the gold limit:
1. Causes the trader/buyer to lose money if they have to convert gold>material or materials>gold
2. Gives an opening for scammers for high end items
3. Artifically inflates the price of certain materials, and maybe contributes to the ebay gold, bot problem

Stormcloud · Dec 30, 2006, 02:24 PM // 14:24

The reason for the cap is simple. Anet never wanted anything in the game to cost over 100k. As such I see no reason to increase the cap.

Antheus · Dec 30, 2006, 02:38 PM // 14:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shanaeri Rynale

Point I'm making is
Having to use another material to supplement the gold limit:
1. Causes the trader/buyer to lose money if they have to convert gold>material or materials>gold
2. Gives an opening for scammers for high end items
3. Artifically inflates the price of certain materials, and maybe contributes to the ebay gold, bot problem

Having a single set of currency causes unlimited inflation. Look at any game that uses that model. As time goes on, prices of items skyrocket into absurdity. It has nothing to do with money cap.

By tying the economy to statically priced resource (rare crafting materials) this problem is elminated.

In Diablo 2, Jordan stones were same as gold. Gold and stones were obtained from loot, but there was no static value assigned to either. And as such, inflation went through the roof. And at the same time, D2 used capped money. But without a mechanism to set the value of that money, market ran away. Same goes for all other games.

In GW, ectos are constantly traded, reulting in consistent fine-grained unlimited money sink. This is how alternate market controls the prices.

In WoW, secondary materials market determines the price of everything. While there's strong fluctuations, prices are relatively stable.

Star Wars Galaxies - items that used to be hard to sell for 50k now cost 50 million.

Having a single linear currency, no matter how large results in endless inflation. Having orthogonal currencies, keeps market in check.

A linear function can never even remotely be balanced. There's either extreme inflation, or extreme shortage. But never good balance.

What do ectos and resources have to do with money cap? Everything. They are what makes the 100k cap irrelevant, since, even after 20 months, insane farming bot exploits, eBay running rampant, the economy is completely stable. Even more, price spikes have been completely eliminated. Every single item is now available for several k, making them, for the first time, completely accessible to everyone.

Unlike runaway models, GW's economy has been balanced and has overcome the high barrier of entry just about every other game imposes.

*Darcy* · Dec 30, 2006, 10:43 PM // 22:43

It doesn't matter why ANet set the cap at 100k. They did and we have to live with it. As there is only a small percentage of the game population that is affected by the cap, I don't think they will ever change it. The economy is effectively balanced with only the material price spurts caused by a new chapter.

The high-end traders should be grateful that ANet doesn't really hate them. They could do to the game what they did to the trial keys - prevent trading of items or gold between players (no dropping on the ground either).
Then you would really have a reason to scream as your way of enjoying the game would be gone.

So you will just have to keep contributing to the stability of ecto prices as the rest of us watch you in grateful wonder. I like knowing that my one and only ecto is still worth what it was 4 months ago, when I traded some amber for it.

manitoba1073 · Dec 30, 2006, 11:09 PM // 23:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stormcloud

The reason for the cap is simple. Anet never wanted anything in the game to cost over 100k. As such I see no reason to increase the cap.

No you are wrong. i will say the real reason again why there is a cap.

Quote:

Originally Posted by manitoba1073

The real reason why a chars cap is 100k is because that is the most you can pay for any 1 item from an NPC. There is no other reasons for it. dont listen to anyones speculation as that is the reason.

GET IT GOT IT UNDERSTAND IT. It really is that simple.

Ashleigh McMahon · Dec 31, 2006, 12:17 AM // 00:17

Along with other probably-valid points above, especially about 3-4 digit number storage; it could probably stop Bot's from selling too many rares too fast, and stop inflation get too high.

Shanaeri Rynale · Dec 31, 2006, 12:23 AM // 00:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by manitoba1073

No you are wrong. i will say the real reason again why there is a cap.
GET IT GOT IT UNDERSTAND IT. It really is that simple.

I must be very simple as I don't get the link. To me thats like saying you're not allowed to spend more than 100 Dollars as thats the highest priced item the local store has in stock.

I'm not sure it does slow down the gold sellers, all they do is buy/bot/farm ecto like everyone else.

Edit in response to the below post..

Thats circular reasoning. I.e You cant have more than 100K on a character because the most you can trade is 100K

manitoba1073 · Dec 31, 2006, 01:49 AM // 01:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shanaeri Rynale

I must be very simple as I don't get the link. To me thats like saying you're not allowed to spend more than 100 Dollars as thats the highest priced item the local store has in stock.

I'm not sure it does slow down the gold sellers, all they do is buy/bot/farm ecto like everyone else.

It is very simple. Since the most you can pay for any one item is 100k, there was no need for anymore to be carried around on your character and the fact that you can have your storage opened and carried around with you there was no need for any more to be carried on a char.

No it has nothing to do with gold sellers as the cap came around before there really was that many.

Malice Black · Dec 31, 2006, 02:03 AM // 02:03

Quote:

Why would someone use 8k worth of gold which they saved up to then buy one ecto, if they didnt intend to use it on obsideon armor?

To get rid of cash...once you hit 1mill in cash you are kinda running out of room for more...buying ecto is an easy solution to that problem.

Akhilleus · Dec 31, 2006, 05:49 AM // 05:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

Its one of the few limits we have on trying to prevent over rich players.

one of the most illfounded statements i have EVER seen posted.
if you think for a seccond that the 100k character/1000k storage limits prevent people from aquiring 5, 10, 50 or 100 million in net-worth, you need an awakening.
all the cap does, is force them to put their money into other things; which isnt too big a deal to most players of means, but it is largely inconveniant.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shanaeri Rynale

One counting someones wealth in RL, people seldom just include their cash assets, but also count property, gold, shares etc etc. Such amounts are included in the economic figures also. Therefore people purchasing power is also not limited to their cash figures but also how much other stuff they can liquidate or swap. Therefore the cash limit is a pointless one in terms of limiting wealth, it just gets in the way of people who can and do trade high end items. It does'nt stop them, it's just a pain.

exactly.
you are one of the FEW people in this thread who seem to have an incling of what the heck they are talking about.
people who think the 100k limit stops people from aquring mass amounts of wealth, do not know what they are talking about, period.
ALL the limit does, is keep ecto prices artificially high (people who think that the ecto prices are kept high by people buying FoW armor=laugh), and enable scammers.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antheus

Having a single set of currency causes unlimited inflation. Look at any game that uses that model. As time goes on, prices of items skyrocket into absurdity. It has nothing to do with money cap.

By tying the economy to statically priced resource (rare crafting materials) this problem is elminated.

In Diablo 2, Jordan stones were same as gold. Gold and stones were obtained from loot, but there was no static value assigned to either. And as such, inflation went through the roof. And at the same time, D2 used capped money. But without a mechanism to set the value of that money, market ran away. Same goes for all other games.

In GW, ectos are constantly traded, reulting in consistent fine-grained unlimited money sink. This is how alternate market controls the prices.

In WoW, secondary materials market determines the price of everything. While there's strong fluctuations, prices are relatively stable.

Star Wars Galaxies - items that used to be hard to sell for 50k now cost 50 million.

Having a single linear currency, no matter how large results in endless inflation. Having orthogonal currencies, keeps market in check.

A linear function can never even remotely be balanced. There's either extreme inflation, or extreme shortage. But never good balance.

What do ectos and resources have to do with money cap? Everything. They are what makes the 100k cap irrelevant, since, even after 20 months, insane farming bot exploits, eBay running rampant, the economy is completely stable. Even more, price spikes have been completely eliminated. Every single item is now available for several k, making them, for the first time, completely accessible to everyone.

Unlike runaway models, GW's economy has been balanced and has overcome the high barrier of entry just about every other game imposes.

please know what you are talking about before ranting.
whille i will concede its easier to function as a player now than perhaps a year ago (though the stat differences are still marginal) the seperation in means between the lower class and upper class has actually INCREASED.
and it has NOTHING to do with ecto that GWs economy has been made new-player friendly, and everything to do with the fact that anet has MASSIVELY increased items' drop-rates, introduced greens (inherently "perfect" items with an almost 100% droprate and predictable bosses dropping predictable mods; this increasing the rate of which desired ones are obtained, and simentaneously decreasing their prices).
ecto play into the guildwars economy almost exclusivly for items that bridge the 100k gold limit.
and you forgot to mention that in most other MMORPGS gold isnt nearly ass essential.
as some here may know...i am far from a poor player in guildwars...
well, the level of wealth i possessed in diablo-2 makes my guildwars accounts (preportionally) look damned near destitute. and i cant recall EVER using gold for ANYTHING other than repairing my non-ethereal-zodded weapons. what am i getting at? gold, in guildwars, unlike the majority of mmorpgs, is very, very useful, and for the most part UNLESS you participate in the trading/farming/running economy MOST of your gold will be spent to aquire the items you need to function. in most other mmorpgs, past the early stages, gold is ridiculously easy to come by, and overall not that needed; especially where a seccondary means of transfer exist. such as sojs, 3/20/20s, ectoplasm, etc. the fact that ecto has not taken complete dominance over the vast majority of the economy is soley due to my aforementioned points; that the game uses up a substantial amount of gold.
even the wealthiest players in guildwars need to keep a certain amount of gold if they wish to function at a base level (salvage/id kits etc) and substantially more, the more active they become in the economy; spending hundreds of thousands of plat on armor crafting, runes, etc.
and unlike in other mmorpgs, there is a substantial sub-group...a group of palyers still operating fully with gold, hardly using ecto as a means of currency. these players, while they are poorer, make up a larger percentage of the population. and it is because of them, and the necessity in dealing with them that wealthy players often have to convert gold to ecto, ecto to gold, items to ecto, items to gold, etc.
the the multi-leveled existance of mutiple avinues of investment (developed PLAYER-side, NOT server-side) and the UTTER importance of gold that keeps the market stable as to the lack of any one dominating primary or alternate form of currency. and it is the constant tinkering with droprates that keeps items available to the poorer classes, in various methods and forms.

Da Mad M00 · Dec 31, 2006, 10:20 AM // 10:20

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